Historians usually dismiss Xenophon’s Socratic dialogues out of hand, and rarely will Xenophon’s Socrates even be mentioned in Greek philosophy courses. There is no doubt that Plato was a far better writer than Xenophon, but the writings of Xenophon were highly treasured in both the ancient world and in the Renaissance. Although it is true that the Greek Philosopher Zeno, who studied under Crates, the last Greek Cynic Philosopher, is seen by both ancient and modern scholars as the founder of Stoicism, in a large sense the stoic emphasis of moral philosophy was always present in Greek philosophy, starting with Homer and Hesiod. We will discuss: • How the Stoic Socrates of Xenophon was fond of moral maxims. • How Xenophon’s account of the trial and execution of Socrates differed from Plato’s account. • How Xenophon’s description of Hercules’ encounter with Lady Virtue and Lady Vice was treasured by St Justin Martyr, and early Church Father, and by many others in the ancient world and in the Renaissance, and was a favored topic of many painters. • How Xenophon’s Socrates’ attitudes towards the gods were similar to the implicit monotheism of the Stoics. • Xenophon and Socrates’ story of the two quarreling brothers. YouTube video: https://youtu.be/LWfoHhtNY8I Please support our channel by purchasing the books we discuss from Amazon, we receive a small associate’s commission: Conversations of Socrates, by Xenophon, Robin H. Waterfield and, Hugh Tredennick, Translators, Penguin Books https://amzn.to/3vjVrFe

2. Today we will learn and reflect on the Stoic Socrates of Xenophon.
Although it is true that the Greek Philosopher Zeno, who studied under Crates, the last Greek
Cynic Philosopher, is seen by both ancient and modern scholars as the founder of Stoicism, in a
large sense the stoic emphasis of moral philosophy was always present in Greek philosophy,
starting with Homer and Hesiod. Socrates and Plato had such a great an influence over Greek
philosophy that most scholars forget that they were innovators.
We also see in the famous Sistine Chapel painting by Rafael of the Greek Philosophers some of the
famous students of Socrates. His students included Antisthenes, the first Greek Cynic philosophy
that was adapted and advanced some generations later by Zeno, and Aristotle, who, like the
stoics, was fond of discussing lists of virtues and vices, and of course Plato, whose Socratic theory
of the forms can be seen as a mystical representation of Stoic moral philosophy. In this video we
will examine the portrait of Socrates by Xenophon, a Socrates who appears more stoic than the
Platonic Socrates. Xenophon’s Socrates is fonder of moral maxims. Another of Socrates students
was Aristippus of Cyrene, who founded the Cyrenaic school of philosophy, which was later
absorbed by the Epicureans.

3. Alcibiades or Xenophon or Alexander the Great
Plato & Aristotle
Xenophon or Antisthenes
Socrates
The School of Athens, Raphael, circa 1511
Diogenese of Sinope
Zeno, far left, cut off

4. At the end of our talk, we will discuss the sources used for this
video, and you follow along in our PowerPoint script posted on
SlideShare or on our blog. Please, we welcome interesting questions
in the comments. Let us learn and reflect together!

5. YouTube Video:
The Stoic Socrates of Xenophon
https://youtu.be/LWfoHhtNY8I
Blogs:
http://www.seekingvirtueandwisdom.com/
NOTE: YouTube video corrections may not
be reflected on the slides, and the blog
may differ somewhat in content.
© Copyright 2021
YouTube Channel (please subscribe):
Reflections on Morality, Philosophy, and History:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLqDkfFbWhXOnzdjp__YZtg
https://amzn.to/3vjVrFe

6. Historians usually dismiss Xenophon’s Socratic dialogues out of hand, and rarely will
Xenophon’s Socrates even be mentioned in Greek philosophy courses. There is no
doubt that Plato was a far better writer than Xenophon, and that Xenophon
composed only a handful of Socratic dialogues compared to the dozens of dialogues
Plato and his followers composed.
What is clear is Xenophon’s Socratic dialogues survived intact whereas so many
ancient works have disappeared into the sands of history. In fact, St Justin Martyr
refers extensively to Xenophon’s Socrates in his apology to the Roman Senate. Since
Xenophon’s Socrates is more of a moral philosopher than Plato’s Socrates, you could
argue that Xenophon’s Socrates is closer to Stoicism, which may tell us more about
Xenophon and Plato than Socrates.
When we converted our blogs on the trial and execution of Socrates, our thinking
evolved

7. https://youtu.be/-E3r8Z4IE1c

8. When we converted our blogs on the trial and execution of
Socrates, our thinking evolved, and we compared the Socrates of
Plato with the Stoic Socrates of Xenophon. Xenophon had no
doubt read Plato’s account of the trial and execution of Socrates,
and he wanted to provide his perspective, his Socrates is more of
a moral teacher than Plato’s Socrates. Xenophon has a short work
on Socrates’ Defense, followed by his Memoirs, which tells us how
Socrates led a virtuous life unworthy of his execution.
Many readers when reading Plato’s Apology of Socrates are struck
by his arrogant manner when he is called upon to speak in his
defense in his trial at Athens,

9. There are no prisons in the ancient world, only jails, and often jails are filled
simply by those who irritate the authorities. If you break a law in the ancient
world, you are either fined, exiled, or executed, there are no long prison
sentences. The state does not have the resources to run a prison, so when
you are thrown in jail awaiting a hearing the government expects you to
visit and bring food with you to feed the prisoner, and maybe the jailers
too. We see in our video on the death and execution of Socrates how his
friends were able to come and stay with Socrates for his entire last day on
earth.
How should we interpret his advice in his epistles to the various churches?
Let us ponder the opinions of two leading scholars, one Anglican, one
Orthodox.
https://youtu.be/Mip1vgRKH1E

10. The ever direct Xenophon in the first
paragraph mentions “his arrogant tone,
which was how Socrates actually spoke.” The
translator’s footnote says that the Greek
word for arrogance does not have quite the
negative connotation that it does in English,
that it could “simply imply talking from a high
standpoint.” Perhaps it means something like
supremely over-confident, or morally
superior, or morally condescending, or maybe
just plain uppity.
Like in Plato’s Apology, Socrates does not
spend much time preparing his defense.
When asked why he is not preparing a
defense, he responds, “Since I have
consistently done no wrong, this is the finest
preparation for a defense.” Farewell to Socrates by his wife Xanthippe, Franz Caugic?, 1800

11. Plato’s Socrates tells us that he is ready to die
because he is morally obligated to follow the laws of
the state, whereas Xenophon’s Socrates is more stoic,
he accepts the punishment of death because he
prefers to die with dignity before dementia sets in,
since he is already quite elderly, possibly in his
seventies.

12. Xenophon’s Socrates definitely sounds
Stoic, he sought to die the good Stoic
death. “Socrates was so arrogant in court
that he invited the juror’s ill-will and more
or less forced them to condemn him. His
fate was proper to one loved by the gods,
because he both avoided the most difficult
part of life and gained the easiest of
deaths. His fortitude was obvious, since
he decided death was the better option,
he showed no weakness in the face of
death, but awaited it cheerfully.”

13. XENOPHON’S MEMOIRS OF SOCRATES
In his defense of Socrates, Xenophon opens with the charges against him,
that “he does not recognize the gods recognized by the State, but
introduces new deities, and that Socrates corrupts the youth.”
To answer these charges, Xenophon first points out that Socrates
encouraged those who wish to run estates or a country efficiently should
seek the advice of diviners, such as the Oracle at Delphi. He reasoned
that many things are under men’s control, but there are many events men
can never totally predict regardless of their preparation, like the success
of a harvest, the digging of a well, success in love and war, and the
vagaries of political fortunes.

14. Xenophon thought that those who supposed that
such matters were totally dependent on human
efforts with no divine intervention were actually
superstitious, and it was “also superstitious to
consult diviners on questions which the gods
enabled us to decide by the use of our wits.” “He
said that where the gods have given us power to act
using our intelligence we ought to use it, but where
the outcome is concealed from humans, we should
try to discover it from the gods by divination, for the
gods communicate to those whom they favor.”
Priestess of Delphi (1891) by John Collier,
showing the Pythia sitting on a tripod with vapor
rising from a crack in the earth beneath her.

15. Since Greek Philosophy paved the way in the hearts of the Greeks
for Christianity, what is the take away message for us today? That
we should certainly ask for God’s blessings and intervention as we
face the difficult decisions and undertakings in our lives, but this
should not prevent us from assuming responsibility for the
success of our endeavors, and that we should certainly not blame
God for any difficulties we may encounter. When the twists and
turns of life turn out well, perhaps it was partly due to divine
intervention, or perhaps God gave us the confidence to make the
right decisions and follow through.

16. Xenophon’s Socrates was more the Stoic
Philosopher, Socrates “always discussed human
matters, trying to find out the nature of piety and
impiety, honor and dishonor, right and wrong,
sanity and lunacy, courage and cowardice, State and
statesman”, and all other knowledge that truly good
men would seek.
Xenophon’s Socrates belief in the gods comes close
to the implicit monotheism of the Stoics. Most
Greeks believed that the “gods know some things
but not others, but Socrates believed that the gods
know everything, both words and actions and
unspoken intentions, and that they are present
everywhere and communicate to people about all
kinds of human affairs.” “Socrates prayed to the
gods simply to give him what was good, recognizing
that they know best what is good for us.”
Statues of Plato and Socrates by Leonidas
Drosis at the Academy of Athens

17. Xenophon’s Socrates displayed the Stoic virtues
of self-discipline and controlling the passions.
“Socrates was the most self-disciplined of men
in his sexual and other appetites, he was most
tolerant of cold and heat and hardships of all
kinds, and he trained himself to be moderate,
so he needed few possessions.” Socrates
preferred to teach the moderate virtues mostly
by his own example. “He neither neglected the
body nor commended others for doing so.”
“He was not ostentatious in his clothing or in
his footwear or in the rest of his daily life. He
did not make his associates money-lovers, the
rid them of all other desires except for his
company,” he refused to charge fees, “he was
surprised that a man who taught goodness
would demand a fee for it.”

18. Xenophon’s Socrates quotes Hesiod’s “Works and Days,” which
reminds us of Jesus’ teaching of the wide and narrow path:
“Evil can be easily found, freely;
Smooth is the road, and very near she dwells.
But sweat the gods have set upon the way
To goodness, long and steep is the path to it
And rough at first, but if you reach the summit
Thereafter is it easy, hard though it was.”
Hesiod and Muse, Gustave Moreau, 1891 Dance of the Muses at Mount Helicon, Bertel Thorvaldsen, 1807

19. The most memorable passages in Xenophon where
Hercules meets the ladies Virtue and Vice. The lady Virtue
of Xenophon’s Socrates is elegant, with a genuine noble
character, whereas the lady Vice is plump with a pretension
of nobility, who masquerades herself as a cheaper and less
secure virtue. Lady Vice is an Epicurean, she thinks
pleasure is the primary virtue of life.

20. https://youtu.be/-E3r8Z4IE1c

21. Hercules at the Crossroad, Sebastiano Ricci, 1710’s
Xenophon’s Socrates has the
lady Vice eager to rush ahead of
Virtue, running up to Hercules
saying, “Hercules, I see that you
can’t make up your mind which
way of life to adapt. If you take
me as your friend, I will lead you
by the easiest and most pleasant
road; you shall not miss the
taste of any pleasure, and you
shall live out your life without
any experience of hardship.”

22. Xenophon’s Socrates has a dialogue with an
ungrateful teenager, some things never change, we
will encourage you to read the dialogue for yourself,
we will provide the concluding lecture: “So if you are
sensible, my boy, you will beseech the gods to
pardon any disregard that you have shown towards
your mother in case they count you as ungrateful
and refuse to do you any good; and at the same time
you will take care that your fellow men don’t
observe you neglecting your parents and lose
respect for you so that you stand revealed as
destitute of friends; for if they get the notion that
you are ungrateful to your parents, nobody will
expect gratitude in return for doing you a kindness.”
Socrates and both his wives, Reyer van Blommendael, 1600’s

23. Xenophon’s Socrates engages two quarrelling brothers, and
perhaps in jest the translator suggests, he compares the effort to
getting along with your brother with training your horse. Horses
respond best to kindness, as do brothers. Although the elder
brother should take the lead, Socrates suggests that maybe the
younger brother should try breaking the cycle of animosity by
showing some common courtesy. The younger brother objects,
what if his older brother does not improve?

24. “In that case,” said Socrates, “you
will simply run the risk of showing
that you are a good and affectionate
brother, and that he is a bad brother
who doesn’t deserve to be treated
kindly. But I don’t support that
anything of the sort will happen.
Perhaps when he realizes you are
challenging him to this kind of
contest, he will be very keen to
outdo you in kindness both spoken
and practical.”
Death of Socrates, José Maria de Medeiros, 1878

25. SOURCES:
Although the works of Xenophon are often deprecated by modern
scholars, in the ancient world and in the Renaissance they were
highly valued, and they were so treasured by copyist monks over
the centuries that most of them have survived to the current day.
Although he wrote far fewer dialogues of Socrates than did Plato,
some of these were in response to Plato’s works to give his
perspective of their beloved teacher, Socrates.

26. YouTube Video:
The Stoic Socrates of Xenophon
https://youtu.be/LWfoHhtNY8I
Blogs:
http://www.seekingvirtueandwisdom.com/
NOTE: YouTube video corrections may not
be reflected on the slides, and the blog
may differ somewhat in content.
© Copyright 2021
YouTube Channel (please subscribe):
Reflections on Morality, Philosophy, and History:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLqDkfFbWhXOnzdjp__YZtg
https://amzn.to/3vjVrFe

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quotes in this blog, please type in
the phrase to the search box in
my blog to see the referenced
footnote.
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28. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLqDkfFbWhXOnzdjp__YZtg/